Posts by Plain and simple

5

In search of Truth - all my life

by Plain and simple in

i haven't been a christian, nor a jehovah's witness - i was never convinced of one or the other - because neither added up to what i perceived as "reality" - nor did i see confirmation that they 'were' the one truth/etc in real life.

(i have a brother and brother-in-law who are jehovah's witness, so i know their view all too well, and their inconsistancies, which they choose to ignore) - the more i have learned of jw - the more i have come to hate them even more.

my brother has a mental disability - similarly with my brother-in-law, he has another type of mental illness.

Plain and simple

Here are the pages - you need to type them directly, or copy and paste, or whatever --- http://members.tripod.com/~plain2/indexm1a.htm http://members.tripod.com/~plain2/indexm2a.htm etc The pages are m3a, m4a, etc up to m9a and there is a page-b which shows a still of a crashed Soviet UFO, from 'The Secret KGB UFO files' - I believe. I do have that on videotape and it shows some very interesting video footage from military aircraft of UFOs. I will put all these clips onto a SVCD, and make them available to anyone who wishes to view them. I would put them onto a site, if it can be arranged. My html isn't so good, I was trying to put these UFO stills together, but I had problems getting to display at all. With those pages I have put up, some of the captions may not be 100% correct? I think most are. The above pages m1a - m9a are about artefacts of advanced ancient civilisation here on this earth. Our forgotten history. Well mankind is so many millions of years old, and we have only a history of some sort going back 3000-5000 years? And a very patchy history at that.

You can read up about Edgar Cayce - who is very interesting. I have a clip about him, that was on the 'Mysteries' a long time ago, in the late 1980s?

To answer your question - the human spirit animates the human body, and this human spirit does not die, at death. Just the physical body dies. Your consciousness would go through a transistion to adjust itself to it's new surroundings. The spirit world is our real home - earth is a temporary place for us, while we are here (of course, we forget almost everything, when we are born).

Harvey

5

In search of Truth - all my life

by Plain and simple in

i haven't been a christian, nor a jehovah's witness - i was never convinced of one or the other - because neither added up to what i perceived as "reality" - nor did i see confirmation that they 'were' the one truth/etc in real life.

(i have a brother and brother-in-law who are jehovah's witness, so i know their view all too well, and their inconsistancies, which they choose to ignore) - the more i have learned of jw - the more i have come to hate them even more.

my brother has a mental disability - similarly with my brother-in-law, he has another type of mental illness.

Plain and simple

Thanks for your comments, I do appreciate them.

I haven't actually read the bible recently - but did do an evening class in the history of the bible a long time ago.

My point of view, is from the unexplained. I have read lots of things about the unexplained for over 30 years. It was long long ago that I did read a great deal of books relating to all manner of topics. Like UFOs, UFOs and the Bible (Ezekiel is a good example), ancient civilisations (how advanced their technology was - they used very large heavy blocks which we cannot reproduce today, their scale and scope of engineering - we use much smaller components, which are assembled into a structure). I did have a page on my site about that side of things, but I've forgotten the address for it. [This was not accessible by the menu, you had to know the exact reference to it.] If I find out what it is, I'll post it here in another post. It was scans from the book 'Heaven's Mirror' by Graeme Hancock? I read about psychic phenonena, Near Death Experiences and Out of Body Experiences, etc.

I tend to believe in the unexplained - because this keeps on happening time and time again. They are not isolated events. I tend to view them as the 'truth' and they do interlink with each other, to give you a more accurate world view or cosmology. They of course, do not fit into accepted beliefs and theories - they get rejected because they do not fit in with established views. The UFO phenomena tend to highlight that governments have been lying to us about them. There is a classic book, the 1956 edition of 'The Case for the UFO' which is still readable today, by M. K. Jessup.

The unexplained, does explain things - but you have to have an open mind - or else it appears to be so far fetched and fanciful. Except there is the data/evidence there for that phenomena being true. Skeptics tend to pooh pooh all these things - but they are in complete denial, they won't even look at things - and just dismiss them straight away.

Here is a post, I wrote in a Newsgroup, which sums up what I believe in ....

Evolution is a theory - and all theories are work in progress -
some more accepted than others.

They serve in the intermin until something better comes along.

The accumulation of data/knowledge is a good thing.
But theories tend to reject certain data as invalid - otherwise the
theory seems not to be truthful to the data that is there.

I guess you can apply this to religions and their belief systems.

eg. Jesus, for the christians, is the only one? to have survived death?
Now what if someone else survived death? Would that person also be viewed
like Jesus?

And if everyone did survive death - ie. a person's spirit lives on in the
afterlife - the physical body dies, but the spiritual body lives on.
This would be against all christian beliefs - wouldn't it? And of
Judiasm, and Islam.

And to ask the question - where was the soul before birth?
How do christianity, judiasm and islam answer this?

To those who believe in reincarnation - the answer is, that the afterlife
is our natural home, and we come down to earth, to live a life every so
many thousand? or hundreds of years - for life experiences, which the
soul determines it needs. Also it's possible to go to other dimensions and
other physical worlds for other life experiences.

There is no hard physical evidence for the above, but at least it sounds
plausible enough, if you care to investigate it further (read up about
Near Death Experiences and Out of Body Experiences --- and about
reincarnation, and reincarnation and the bible, etc).

Now provide something that makes more sense than the above?

The one life theory - while simple, doesn't answer all the questions
you may have. ie. you live and you die.

Harvey

Here is a page of spirit photographs that was shown in a US TV program "Beyond". I've never seen these photographs before, or ones like them, so I was very surprised to know these exist at all.

http://members.tripod.com/~plain2/page-a.htm

Oh, yes --- I tend to believe that a lot of religion is 'crap'. There is no other way to put it. They deliberately deceive you and present what I view as 'nonsense'. I think they have to feed something to the public. I don't believe in the trinity at all - I think it is more invention than anything else. What is the christian world view of "reality" here? I can guess at what it is, and I believe that is crap.

I guess the eastern religions, such as Buddhism and Tibetan Buddhism has more of a 'real' feel to it, than others. Jesus is suppose to have gone to the far east to be taught eastern beliefs - and there is the claim that he returned there (he didn't die or go off to heaven, etc) and his tomb is in Kashmir. There is a TV 'Did Jesus Die?' that was shown over Easter here, which was well presented. I can get around to providing a transcript of that part of it, if there's the interest in it? I can get around to putting it onto a SVCD, and make it available to anyone who has a DVD player that can play SVCDs? Or on their computer?

Harvey

125

Is the Bible Just B.S.?

by shamus in

do you think that god enjoys killing people?

it sure sounds like it to me; jw doctrine more or less scared me into thinking that god is going to kill all persons whom he/she thinks is not doing his will.

my question is, how can god kill someone for not being "christian", or following the bible out of sheer ignorance?

Plain and simple

There are many aspects to take into account when discussing religion and the bible - an established religion, etc. You have so called basic truths (do unto others as you would have them do unto you - basic good human behaviour towards others - or codes of conduct, re: ten commandments) - these should not be contradictory - so, the eye for an eye - of course is nonsense. The killing will never end, if you believe in this. The worse thing about religion is the 'establishment' of itself, in which it seeks to keep 'itself' alive - through recruitment, and then having various tools to keep people in their religion. And so they made up all this rubbish that passes for it's truth - such crap as - 'Only through Jesus Christ can you be saved' --- he, never said that. We can see that he is a humble man who doesn't make a big thing about himself - it is only with his passing (and non presence) does all this crap get laid on.

And what exactly is the christian view about the purpose of life, and what happens after death. I don't believe in resurrection - no. Reincarnation seems to be likely, and that this is what he taught, but was edited out of the bible and omitted from his teachings.

Anyway rubbish has been added on, through the centuries and misinterpretations. The bible is not without errors and misunderstandings. With so many translations and mistranslations, misinterpretations and reintrepretations, you can put any spin you wish to, upon what you take out of the bible - and isn't there a great deal there, not explainable? Like Ezekiel in which it seems to be some description of a UFO sighting.

5

In search of Truth - all my life

by Plain and simple in

i haven't been a christian, nor a jehovah's witness - i was never convinced of one or the other - because neither added up to what i perceived as "reality" - nor did i see confirmation that they 'were' the one truth/etc in real life.

(i have a brother and brother-in-law who are jehovah's witness, so i know their view all too well, and their inconsistancies, which they choose to ignore) - the more i have learned of jw - the more i have come to hate them even more.

my brother has a mental disability - similarly with my brother-in-law, he has another type of mental illness.

Plain and simple

Thanks James for your comments.

I'd rather put my trust in events that keep on happening to people time and time again, than in one mythical figure who may or may not have lived 2000 years ago. I have grave doubts that his teachings were faithfully carried down to us today - because of the confusion that is handed down to us. Like Islam, once the founding figure was gone --- how can we be sure that it has been carefully handed down?

Whereas with near death experiences - these events keep on happening, same too, with past lives memories that some people have --- there are many varied cases in which details have been checked out, and it has not been a case of fantasy, but rather, details have been colloborated. The truth is out there, in all these varied incidences and altogether they build a fabric of truth which does fit into a whole, if you care to have an open mind, which can comprehend them.

I have been reading about the unexplained for over 30 years or thereabouts - and these events/etc do not go away. If you're into a religion, maybe these cases are dismissed instantly because they do not fit into that religion/belief/etc. When this is genuine phenomena - you're merely excluding the truth from your own beliefs, etc. They cannot be explained in terms of established religions/etc - and it shows how much they are from the 'truth'.

It is always beneficial to discuss such matters, even if you may disagree with them? Good solid reasoning is always good to see, to see if your reasoning is indeed reasonable? Someone not afraid of the truth is open to such discussions, even if they do get heated? --- I'm always for seeing if something is indeed truthful and genuine. I don't mind putting my views under a microscope, and tearing it apart to see if it does get put back together again? I'll smash anything to bits, to see if it is truthful or not? Ideas can take such hammering and questioning. And the truth can stand such inquiry.

125

Is the Bible Just B.S.?

by shamus in

do you think that god enjoys killing people?

it sure sounds like it to me; jw doctrine more or less scared me into thinking that god is going to kill all persons whom he/she thinks is not doing his will.

my question is, how can god kill someone for not being "christian", or following the bible out of sheer ignorance?

Plain and simple

You should critique the bible just as you would any other document. Those who put the fear of god in you - are just sounding their own horn and want you to join them - and religion uses various tools of fear to get you to join, and to stay in with them, through fear. Oh, they tell you this is true - and it isn't --- because it doesn't stand up to examination using commonsense, logic and reason. Tools to use, to see if there is any truth to it. There is some truth there, but sadly over the centuries it has accumulated a lot of crap with it. And those who quote the bible - and can imagine them living in those times, are just living in a fairy tale that they choose to believe in. It's a fabrication, some hollywood movie, they imagine themselves in.

There is such a thing as spirituality and awareness, heart and spirit - that is of good things. Love, understanding, compassion, etc --- these do exist in all of us, if we choose to acknowledge them, and all that can unite us, for good. Just be aware that religion was hijacked a long time ago for political ends, and it is still is.

5

In search of Truth - all my life

by Plain and simple in

i haven't been a christian, nor a jehovah's witness - i was never convinced of one or the other - because neither added up to what i perceived as "reality" - nor did i see confirmation that they 'were' the one truth/etc in real life.

(i have a brother and brother-in-law who are jehovah's witness, so i know their view all too well, and their inconsistancies, which they choose to ignore) - the more i have learned of jw - the more i have come to hate them even more.

my brother has a mental disability - similarly with my brother-in-law, he has another type of mental illness.

Plain and simple

I haven't been a Christian, nor a Jehovah's Witness - I was never convinced of one or the other - because neither added up to what I perceived as "reality" - nor did I see confirmation that they 'were' the one truth/etc in real life. (I have a brother and brother-in-law who are Jehovah's Witness, so I know their view all too well, and their inconsistancies, which they choose to ignore) - the more I have learned of JW - the more I have come to hate them even more. My brother has a mental disability - similarly with my brother-in-law, he has another type of mental illness. I know that JW will dis-own them and not provide any support for them, if they need real help at some later time.

Anyway, I'm all for reason and logic, with lots of commonsense - sadly all reigions reject this (speaking of christianity, islam and judiasm in particular) because they take their bible/etc as being the one truth and everything else revolves around IT. This of course, does not add up --- you only have to look at history of the bible, or the history of that church/belief to see that it doesn't. Using such excuses as - mankind is flawed, you need to have faith, etc does not validate a religion or belief. There must be proof. And it does have to add up (fit in with what you have observed [and experienced - if it can] in the real world). And you can't throw out commonsense - and reason and logic.

Anyway I do believe you can find the truth - but the truth is far stranger than we can ever imagine it to be --- because established and accepted beliefs/etc are not close to the truth. Are you ready for the truth? I think not. The unexplained does not fit into established and accepted beliefs - yet these strange events keep on happening time and time again. Such things as UFOs/aliens, reincarnation (past life memories), Near Death Experiences and Out of Body Experiences (these are related) and pyschic phenomena, etc. There are real events, and there are some which may not be --- and so like everything you have to discern for yourself what is truthful or not? We deal with such decisions all the time. Such as what is a good car/whatever to buy. Why not use exactly the same line of reasoning/investigation/comparison/etc for examination of ideas and beliefs? You can.

What you will get is a more accurate perception of this reality. There is still the ordinary everyday stuff, that we live in - we all do that. Then there is what is exactly happening all around us, in the world of ideas and beliefs. I think that a lot of religion is crap (not all of it) because distortions occurred soon after it's formation - take islam, christianity and judiasm. I think all are badly corrupted.

Taking an example - you cannot take the bible as 100% accurate and literally true. It is not that at all. So when you're discussing the actual text - it is not a real life example. It is a hollywood script that you are discussing. It did not happen exactly as it is written. How many authors are there of the bible, and can you be sure of even one author - as you can be of a present day author, and look up details about their life, so that you can better understand what they have written. How many language translations have the bible undergone? How many unknown edits have there been done? Known and unknown. And how much has language, culture and technology, etc has changed since those times and now (and also the persons who handled the translations/edits/etc how their times have changed too) - and now tell me, you still believe in the bible being 100% factual and true, in spite of all these changes that has been going on. Doesn't some things in the bible read very strange? Like in Ezekiel? Was it UFO sightings that were being described? Would not a UFO be described in those terms? Viewed as godly? And would not a person who landed via a present day helicopter or aircraft perhaps be described as an 'angel'?

How many millions of years has mankind supposedly been on this earth? And how much of this recorded history, do we accurately know of? 3,000 to 5,000 years perhaps. And still with lots of gaps in knowledge of this era. And what happened in those other times, in which we 93%? know of nothing. Those of biblical times and beyond - in the old Testament. What were those times really like? We have no idea? Surely people of those times were not as ignorant as we think them to be? I think not. People don't accept that there was a highly advanced technological civilisation back in those times and beyond. We are not taught that. Yet there are remnants/puzzles all over the world of technologies we do not know about. Particularly of stone building which uses very large heavy stones cut to precision and fitted together precisely like jigsaws, which cannot be duplicated by our modern means. We don't build that way at all. We build using smaller pieces that are assembled in some way or fashion.

Anyway this is just an example of what a big wide world is out there - and it's not just out there in deep space, as you look at the evening sky and see that the stars are out, but on this very earth, not on the moon or on Mars - but right here. And it is part of our everyday life - which we are reminded of, when we attend a funeral or birth - there is that wanting to know what life is really about. The exit and entrance we have to this life - do we not all go through that experience, each and every one of us? And no one is special because each and everyone of us are. Religions should not divide us, but unite us, via love and understanding. And I for one would like to take the religions down (those which deserve to be) to the level that they operate on --- and show them for what they really are. Full of crap at times. And reveal what truth they have - what is worth saving in them. That love, compassion and understanding can unite us all, if you want the plain and simple truth. It is not very hard to understand that. No one saved. Everyone survives death intact. We all live on. Life goes on.

This does not mean there is no god. There is not a judgemental and vain god, who needs followers. That god does not exist, except in the mind of those who want a god like that (a fabrication and fantasy). The fire and brimstone god, is a god of imagination and fantasy. The use of fear to keep followers in a religion is one of many tools religion uses.

I wish to write a book about all this - but will anyone read it? These thoughts are hardly original. Others have said it.

My homepage is at http://members.tripod.com/~plain2